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The Future of Food is Getting “Better Better” thanks to WhatIf Foods and Chris Langwallner

The Future of food is getting “Better Better” thanks to WhatIf Foods and Chris Langwallner.

WhatIF Foods believes in a better better.

Tasty, delicious foods that are better for our bodies, better for our taste buds and farmer buds alike. Better for degraded lands, our eco-systems and naturally… better for cows.

Today I had the chance to have a conversation (via zoom) with WhatIF Food’s Chris Langwallner to talk about inspiration, their foods, their flavors and the science and technology making it all happen.

This conversation has been edited for length and clarity.  For the full conversation visit our YouTube channel.

Today we are here with Chris Langwallner from What If Foods. Thanks for joining us today.

Absolute pleasure. I cannot thank you enough. It’s fantastic to be here and letting our story get out a little bit. So thank you very much. I’m excited because it’s gonna be a lot of fun.

 

 

We’re talking about plant-based foods, we’re talking about planet based foods and for a “better-better” world. I’m hoping you’ll clarify that for us.

 

I look forward to it. Yes, it’s all about a planet based food company. It’s all about regenerating. It’s all about reconnecting to communities, restoring the greater land, and making sure that we are replenishing the nutrients we need on a day-to-day basis.

 

What inspired you to get into plant-based food?

 

To be honest with you, as a planet based company I think what really inspired me to get into a better way of doing things is actually a call out of my grandfather.

He has been always saying, leave this planet a better world than how you found it. When I was a young boy, I couldn’t understand. It was too abstract. I couldn’t really get my head around. But as I was then working in the industry for 20, 25 years you look behind the scenes, and you see how food is being manufactured on large scale and how profitability over shadows a lot of decision making.

And on the other flip side of the coin, there is a community out there, about 2.6 billion people. This planet makes a direct income or an indirect income from farming activities. And the vast majority, more than two thirds of these people are the poorest of the poor. And we are leaving them behind. And that’s not fair to them because what we have on the plates has been harvested by them.

They take care of their land. And if we leave them behind in the current state of affairs We’ll see many tears in their eyes. And it doesn’t have to be that way. It can be totally different. And hence my strife was really to look at the planetary health and its affairs as well as humanity overall.

And thinking about that must be a better way of doing things and how can we improve it, not incrementally, but really make a system change. And here we are basically inspired by my grandfather. 

On your website, you take some very science-based heavy content and you make it fun and easy.  Talk about that process.

 

It’s a team effort. Honestly, there’s a huge team behind the scenes that works tirelessly on improving our communication and our style and our tone. But the essence of it all is that we understand that Gen Zs and today’s youth are essentially those consumer groups that are on this planet.

Probably the first sort of generation that is fully educated in sustainability. And they have their ability today by one click of a button to really look behind the scenes and understand whether or not there is BS or whether or not there’s transparency, there’s honesty, and there is a different approach to things.

So that is one aspect of things. So we wanted to really make sure we are speaking to the youth on this planet. The second aspect of it all is that, You open your social media feeds today, or you open a media channel, you switch on your television and you are bombarded with bad news, after bad news.

And quite frankly, I have worked in universities and with students and I have been shocked by the fact that people, young guys, talk to me, ‘Hey, I don’t care about sustainability. I don’t care about our planet because it’s so crappy. Everything is so bad. I might as well just enjoy the time span I have on this planet.’

 

And I was shocked in contrast to what my grandfather told me. Today’s youth, some of them, not all, a fraction of them think like that. Or in other words I met this young girl and she says, I don’t know if I want to have children. Because I don’t know whether or not I would like to give birth to people that then inherit a planet that is so hot.

And all of that together was just making me restless and I wanted to really change things and and take this finite time span that I have on this planet to try as hard as I possibly can to leave it better than I found it. And that’s what I strive for. Hence we’re speaking with a fun and engaging voice.

We are speaking with colors and we are speaking with cartoons so that we basically get this heavy message across in an uplifting way and saying, Hey, you can be part of something. That actually does the opposite. It’s not grim. Yes. If we change, we can make this. We’re a better place and here we are.

Thanks for the call out. The credit goes to my team.

 

As we segue into the products themselves, what I wanna highlight is this BamNut Is that the nickname for the Bambara Groundnut?

 

Yeah, so we came up with Bamnut as a short version, as an acronym for the Bambara Ground Nut, which in reality is a legume, a legume that helps us fix nitrogen organically in soils that are essentially degraded and left behind by intensive agriculture.

The Bamnut word came about in Singapore. We actually did not quite know when we started using it. We didn’t quite know how the Americans would pronounce it. And then we found out, alright, it’s the Bamnut. So it all turned out to be so witty and entertaining and just perfect fit for a “better, better” to be honest.

 

Because that’s a main ingredient in all of your food. Let’s talk about what is a BamNut. Why is it magical and unique?

 

I was walking through the world of agro food over the past 20 years, and I’ve always been hugely concerned about the massive speed of land degradation, particularly on arid land.

And that’s getting accelerated because of climate change; and the weather is changing; and the rains and the monsoons are not hitting regularly anymore. So it becomes increasingly more difficult to plant, the planting season to make sure that you are having the seeds in the ground before the rains hit them and so on and so forth.

So it becomes really challenging for folks. So land turpitation has always been a huge concern of mine because another, on the flip side of that, we are losing about 25 soccer fields worth of arid land every minute, while at the very same minute, the same amount of primary forests have been cut down.

So if you compare and contrast these two figures, what it tells me is that in order to make way for the old food industry, we actually cut primary forest and we leave land behind. And that is the wrong thing to do. That is one aspect of things. 

The other aspect of things is I had once the fantastic opportunity to have an interview with Dr. Roy Steiner of the Rockefeller Foundation. And he gave a casual shoutout and he said, nowhere in the world do we produce and consume enough legumes. And I was thinking, why does he say that? But then it’s quite obvious if you think it through, because we are depending so much on crops that the land that basically holds the crops is deprived from organic nitrogen fixing crops like the legumes, and in the absence of nitrogen being fixed through the legumes, we throw endless amounts of synthetic fertilizers on the ground in order to make up for it.

That’s an aspect of things that also worried me.  But today the input costs have gone through the roof is it unravels all over the world and it has gotten more and more expensive to do so the degrading of land in one pocket, I was basically going through my work with that sort of lens.

Then there’s this whole water issue. We are big time irrigating crops, but what does that do? It just slows down the loss of water tables because the moment we take water out of the ground, the water tables are collapsing. I have numbers for that. I had a business in India a long time ago, and it used to be 30 meters, and today it’s probably 90 to 120 meters.

So water is basically a huge issue. There was another lens through which I looked at, and then I was at a conference in Jakarta, and I happened to run into a scientist. He said to me that he works on the Bambara groundnut. It’s a complete crop.  I thought, “Oh, that’s interesting. So what does that mean?”

And I started to really explore that much more deeper. And a complete crop turns out to be essentially a crop that has all micronutrients in the sort of right balance that we need. On top of it, it has all nine essential amino acids that we need. It has rich fatty acids, quality fatty acids, as well as car complex carbohydrates.  So fiber. 

You remember the forgotten macronutrient fibers for our microbiomes? So I got really inspired. So I looked up the amino acid profile and I saw it is rich in plutonic acid or spartic acid. So these are very cool amino acids in terms of generating nice flavors. And off I was; I organized the first couple of five kilos and the trial started, and that’s years and years ago.

In the meantime, the Bambara groundnut actually taught us a few lessons because it’s a very hearty nut and it really takes an effort to make cool products outta it.

 

It’s called a complete product, is that correct?

 

A complete food.  A complete crop or complete food crop.

 

Right now all of the products on your website are based from BamNut. I see Bam Nut milk. I see noodles with seasonings, and then there’s bundles and swag and all kinds of delicious things.

In the future, are we expanding that beyond or what’s the scope?

 

We would love to explore new categories as we build our business. There are so many occasions throughout the day where we can actually incorporate the bambara ground in exciting products, and we look forward to doing that.

Our focus right now is definitely our milk portfolio. It’s a wonderful product. I encourage everybody to have a little taste and Judge for yourself. We have a client in Los Angeles, a coffee roaster, who said ‘This is the closest thing to cow milk that I’ve ever seen in plant-based milk.’ 

We call it planet based milk. I have to say again, shout out to my team in the R&D side of things because they have established a wonderful product essentially with just three ingredients: that’s water, the bambara groundnut, not coconut oil. The rest is essentially technology behind the scenes that actually makes it foam nicely, very stable foam, small bubbles. So you can do latte art. 

Our Airy [flavor] is essentially the one that I would use for a nice drink, like a shake.

In between there is the Every Day [flavor] that goes essentially into my cereal in the morning. 

What are the flavors?

 

Today we are in the market with three different products.

The first one in a slightly black sort of packaging is the Barista. It has the richest mouthfeel. It is the creamiest. We have designed it to perform fantastic or be able to perform fantastic latte art. So it really goes into the cappuccino sort of an experience rather nicely.

I personally take it also for Boba tea. I might as well use the bambara groundnut and foam it up. 

I have my little trick with the barista. I actually froth it in the frother and I put my espresso shot into the frother with the barista together. So I froth it together. But that is just me. I just like it that way. 

Then we have the purple package, which is our Everyday. My wife uses it in baking. We do make cakes, like traditional Austria style, and we totally use only the Everyday [flavor] for that.

Friends of mine [pour] it into their cereals in the morning. It’s a little bit richer, earthy, nutty in character because we do tend to roast the nuts a little bit stronger in the process of making it.

Last but not least, we have our Airy [flavor], which is the lightest one of it all. It is the mint colored package. It is the one that people take into milkshakes and protein shakes. 

 

Let’s move on to Noodles

 

We wanted to create technologies that help us regenerate what’s broken. And today a large portion of all ramen that is being consumed on a day-to-day basis globally is deep fried in palm oil. Palm oil leaves huge banks of land degraded behind, particularly after the third cycle of palm plantations being grown.

We see the aftermath of the palm plantation industry essentially now in Southeast Asia. Therefore we were alerted when we started this project to basically say no to frying and no to deep frying and no, to essentially dehydrating instant noodles or ramen using that sort of process.

So we invented a technology that actually took that sort of challenge away. We invented an industrial scale air frying technology. Once you actually don’t fry anymore, you save about 20% of the space because 20% of palm oil is [based] in the noodle product of classic ramen.  That’s what it absorbs in the frying process. 

So if you don’t deep fry, you save 20%. Now nutrients will survive. Now colors may survive.  Then we replaced all the palm oil with the Bambara. 

We started to actually say, how can we bring color and different flavors and textures on the plates of consumers? And we created these four different products with the four different colors, which is essentially the black one, which is charcoal driven, moringa is green, pumpkin is orange and the original is yellow.

So four different options, all the same philosophy. 

The backbone of making it is the same, but then we add different nutrients to it to have fun, and then we add fancy seasonings to it, which makes just a nice flavor experience as well.

 

 

Our audience is passionate, hungry, curious, foodies. What does it actually taste like?

 

I’m extremely proud of our Noodles because even without the seasonings, you can cook them up and eat them and you will have a wonderful experience.

Try and contrast that with other ramen that you find in the market, and you will come back to our offering immediately because they’re just tasting nice. 

So our starting point of then adding the seasonings to it, like hot and spicy, or the mushrooms is an easy undertaking. It is actually an easy sort of concept to work with because if you have a neutral and nice taste to start with from the noodle base, you can build interesting flavor profiles on top.

Rather than having to use heavy flavors to mask off-flavor from a product base, or not so nice processes or even crappy raw materials. We don’t have that challenge. 

We also decided very early on to keep the salt at a minimum to stay away from any flavor enhancers. No MSG,  we’ve tried to keep it as clean as we possibly can.

We’ve tried to use as much spice as we can access.  No flavoring and stuff like that. I’ve been in that industry for over 20 years.  We thought let’s stay honest, to the product as well, to the noodles as well. And that has been a fantastic journey.

Our “Original, is a hot and sweet, hot and spicy pairing.  In Southeast Asia, it’s based on wok cooking. That’s my personal favorite. I eat it on salads with a little bit of a balsamico dressing

We have with Sesame Garlic, many kids who go for a green one. 

Pumpkin with the traditional Indian curry offer a great pairing. Watch out, it comes hot and spicy.  Typical Indian flavors. 

Last but not least is our charcoal with mushrooms. It’s fantastic for, if you go out to have a beer and come home and wanna have a bite, go for it. It’s a good one. 

How did you decide which flavors to choose? Was it a lot of trial and error?

 

There’s a lot of trial and error. There’s a lot of pairing up with our noodles.

What we have tried to do is really look into what are the best pairings for these sort of flavors.

From that point of view, we also wanted to stay with our seasonings. We wanted to stay essentially planet based.  None of our ingredients have any animal derived products in it.

You look at the charcoal, you cook it up, you eat it, you give it to a chef, let him experiment around. 

We had a Spanish chef take our charcoal and put it into a paella. All of a sudden there was a totally different sort of recipe.

The way we actually derived the final products has also a lot to do with people that actually use it day-to-day in the kitchen and learn from them.

 

What’s the future of WhatIf foods?

 

We are going to enter new categories of food and we are gonna expand our existing categories with new products. 

But I probably would love to use the opportunity to take you along on a more philosophical sort of journey for WhatIf foods and what comes hopefully in the next couple of years to come, because I think we have a better opportunity that needs doubling down now.

What I’m talking about is really the cost of the way we are making everything right from originating bambara groundnut, with partnering farming communities in all parts of Ghana. Encouraging them, making the ingredients ourselves, and then making the food applications, making the food, and then basically taking it to retail all the way through to Manhattan and other parts of the US.

So it’s that entire regenerative value chain that we have created and what that actually represents to us is an opportunity to really explore the intersection between soil health and restoring the soil that has been once degraded from intensive agriculture. 

It is that intersection of renewable energy because the Bambara groundnut now grows in a shell and hence the shell has energy in there and can be used in order to fire up essentially for power.

If you do that smartly, you generate biochar. With biochar, you then actually sequester carbon from the atmosphere into the soils permanently for hundreds, if not a thousand years to come.

 And last but not least, another intersection is wellbeing for consumers. We call them “Better Believers” as well as farming communities because we work with them directly.

We are proud of the fact that we have increased profit, not income; profit of farmers who work with us by 300%. 

At 2.5 acres, these farmers are permanently uplifted above the poverty line. That’s the intersection we really wanna double down to. Again, soil health, renewable energy, carbon sequestration.

Well-being for both the better believers as consumers, as well as the farming communities. Its possible and we’re looking forward to doing that on a large scale. If we wanna fulfill the demand that we hopefully can create, then we will probably need about 20,000 farmers to do that in the next five to ten years to come.

And then generate all the energy that we need internally to be there for carbon zero.  Even further carbon or maybe even participate in the carbon market through certificates. That’s our next challenge. That’s where we wanna go.

 

Find more about What If Foods on their website

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Thanksgiving in NYC: the perfect stuffing bread DOES exist – and it’s… [Recipe here]

This Thanksgiving in NYC, the perfect stuffing bread DOES exist – and it’s brioche.  As in St Pierre Brioche Thanksgiving Stuffing

No Thanksgiving spread is complete without a hearty stuffing. While add-ins are a matter of preference, choosing the right bread is crucial. One underrated choice is eggy, rich brioche – and with St Pierre Bakery, you don’t need to go to France to get it.

Thanks to its butter and egg content, St Pierre’s Brioche Loaf provides the perfect balance of crisp toastiness while remaining soft and creamy inside, while its lightly sweet flavor adds a decadent quality that can still lean savory. Attached below is an approachable recipe for stuffing allowing for all the craveable crunch for the whole family with minimal effort required.

St Pierre Brioche Thanksgiving Stuffing

By @BrandiMilloy

Ingredients

1 loaf St. Pierre Brioche Bread
1/2 cup unsalted butter

1 medium onion, diced

3/4 cup celery, diced

3/4 cup carrots, diced

1 cup mushrooms, diced

2 large eggs

1 tbsp. fresh rosemary, chopped

3 sprigs fresh thyme, just the leaves

1 tbsp. fresh sage, chopped

1 small apple (granny smith works well), peeled and diced

Salt and pepper

Directions

  1. Preheat oven to 350 F. Cut brioche bread into 1” cubes and bake for about 10-15 minutes until toasted.

  2. Meanwhile, into a pot over medium high heat add butter until melted. Add onion, celery and carrots and cook until everything starts to soften, about 7 minutes.  Add mushrooms and cook for 2 minutes longer.  Remove from heat and set aside.

  3. Into a bowl whisk together the eggs, herbs, apples, mushrooms, and salt and pepper. Add your cooked vegetables and mix to combine.

  4. Pour mixture on top of toasted bread and stir to combine. Bake stuffing for about 45 minutes. If your stuffing starts to get too brown, cover until finished baking. Enjoy!

As America’s favorite brioche brand, St Pierre’s products are widely available via grocery stores nationwide as well as Walmart.

The Rise of Mushroom Coffee: A New Era in Health-Conscious Brewing

In today’s health-focused culture, where wellness transcends mere goals to become a lifestyle, mushroom coffee is emerging as a leading trend. This innovative beverage combines the classic energizing effects of coffee with components often linked to the reputed benefits of medicinal mushrooms. Such a blend makes mushroom coffee a more mindful, health-oriented option for daily consumption, resonating especially with those who weave wellness into their daily routines.

Image courtesy of Freepik

The uniqueness of mushroom coffee lies in its ability to enhance the usual coffee experience by potentially offering additional benefits. For those who find regular coffee too acidic, mushroom coffee presents a more stomach-friendly option. Additionally, it incorporates adaptogenic mushrooms, which are believed to help the body better manage stress. This attribute makes mushroom coffee especially enticing to wellness enthusiasts and those seeking a natural way to support their body’s stress response.

The Rise of Mushroom Coffee

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Finding a coffee that delivers on both taste and health promises can be a daunting task. Leading the initiative is More.Longevity & Wellbeing with its Coffee Superfood Blends. These products are meticulously developed, selecting each ingredient for its quality and scientific backing, ensuring they contribute effectively to the blend. Flavors such as Salted Caramel Vanilla and Mocha are designed to mask the natural earthiness of mushroom, making the beverage more enjoyable while enhancing its appeal. The addition of adaptogens and essential vitamins in the blends aims to support overall health by boosting immunity, enhancing energy, and improving mental clarity.

The Rise of Mushroom Coffee

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The company’s commitment to radical transparency ensures that consumers receive a product free from unnecessary fillers and additives, affirming a respect for consumer health and environmental sustainability. This level of honesty and ecological consideration is becoming increasingly important to consumers who prefer products that are both healthy and environmentally conscious.

As the trend continues to carve a niche within the beverage market, consumers are presented with expanding choices. It’s no longer just about picking a brand; it involves selecting a philosophy and a level of quality that resonates with personal health values and taste preferences. The coffee not only invites coffee lovers to rethink their daily mug but also serves as a gateway to a more mindful and intentional morning routine.

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Are NYers falling in love with New Wine? Dancing Wines from Cynthia Russell, Lauren Russell

Are NYers falling in love with New Wine? Dancing Wines from Cynthia Russell, Lauren Russell in Dry Creek Valley, Sonoma County.

The team at Dancing Wines is developing a collection of sensory brands that celebrate life through taste, touch and aroma – inspiring you to find your inner dance and show the world what truly moves you.

Dancing Wines’ red wine trio includes Old Vine, Duo and Estate — three limited-release wines made from hand-picked grapes that showcase the full breadth of the Dancing estate.

Lauren Russell (L) and Cynthia Russell (R) from Dancing Wines

Lauren Russell (L) and Cynthia Russell (R) from Dancing Wines Credit: https://instagram.com/DancingSonoma

Today’s conversation with the dynamic Mother / Daughter team Cynthia and Lauren Russell from Dancing Wines ha been edited for length and clarity.

For the full, un-edited conversation, visit our YouTube channel here.

Joe Winger: What is the most important message you’d like to share today?

Lauren Russell: I think one of them is dancing is art and art is life.

Another is love needs no explanation. I think really the thread between those is we’re trying to create a product and an experience that brings people together and invites them to find their inner dance, which is something we say a lot. 

So we want to encourage people to find their unique rhythms. And wine is also really lovely because it is a vehicle that brings people together to enjoy a moment and diverse people together.

I think my Mom [Cynthia] can speak to this as well, but one of the things we thought about when first exploring wine was just how daunting the whole atmosphere is around the consumption of it and the buying and using all the right adjectives.

Especially for my generation I feel like there’s a bit of a learning curve. So I think one thing we really want people to take away from the brand is just like, just enjoy it. Love needs no explanation and you can’t drink wine when your mouth is full of adjectives. We’ve created a great wine just for you to be able to enjoy and to describe however you want and enjoy whenever you want.

DancingWines

Source: WeAreDancing.com

Cynthia: Yeah, I think the measures we created we have a beautiful heritage property that the soil and the climate create this great wine. And me being of an older generation where wine was very intimidating, even though I know a lot about it.

And drinking it for a very long time. I’ve lived in France. I’ve lived in California. It’s still when you order in a restaurant, you’re scared. Do I know enough? I’m going to be embarrassed. Is this the right pairing? And what the good news is that wine making in the world has become so sophisticated that if you are buying wine from a place that is special, including all.

Sonoma or France or Italy, the wines are good, they’re really good and all you have to do is be comfortable with yourself and enjoying it. And so that’s what we’re trying to do is take a product that has thousands of years of history as being a part of our culture and make you comfortable with just having fun, enjoying it and celebrating what wine can do to bring people together.

DancingWinesSonoma

Source: WeAreDancing.com

Joe Winger: You have a really unique story that you restored a vineyard up in Dry Creek.  Can you talk about experience and what you learned from the restoration?

Cynthia: We lucked out.  It was a Covid purchase. We spent a lot of time as a family together in very small confined spaces drinking a lot of wine. 

We [thought we] might end up needing a place where we have more outdoor space and can be together. So we bought this property more as a farm and then discovered that it was a unique part of the world. 

Zinfandel grapes have been growing in this small region for over 150 years.

It was called America’s grape back in the time I think [the] 1850s. Okay, we have these vineyards. They’re really old. 

There was one owner at this property for 60 years, an older Italian gentleman. And a lot of the area is multi generation, fourth generation Italian families who came over and cultivated this grape.

We never intended to make wine and yet we were scared to let this history and heritage die. 

So we took classes and tried to figure out, can we make wine?

It’d be such a shame to let this history go in this special place. 

We made a great discovery, which was that you don’t have to be an expert on wine. You just have to have great soil and a great climate. 

Then we launched from there. 

DancingWinesSonoma

Source: WeAreDancing.com

Lauren:  We’re always towing the line between the respective tradition and traditional winemaking and the land and all of the old vines and creating something new. 

She [Mom, Cynthia] always brings a lens of respect for the older generation and ways of life and what wine has meant to her throughout her life.

I’m always pushing the other direction. We always land somewhere in the middle. 

You’ll see that in the brands, it has really playful branding and packaging.  But, our winemaking is a bit more traditional. We’re a sustainable vineyard but we have old vines and we respect what the land has to offer and what it’s been offering in that region for a long time.

It creates a better product and brand for us because we get to cater to both audiences.

DancingWinesSonoma

Credit: https://instagram.com/DancingSonoma

Joe Winger: You have a collection of sensory brands.  Can you talk about what that collection is, what inspired the idea, and what we should be looking for?

Lauren:  All of the products have been and will be inspired by the backdrop of the vineyard. 

When we talk about wine, we talk about this kind of multi sensory experience, whether that’s aroma or where you’re having it, who you’re enjoying it with.

We came into wine knowing that it was going to be not just about taste or smell, but about the holistic experience of what wine could do for someone. 

Sort of the thread between all of our products are taste, touch and smell. Again, like finding your inner dance and allowing you to express your personality.

We’re launching a trio of fragrances, which are loosely inspired by the terroir and the vineyard.

Cynthia: We have a fresh perspective on Sonoma. Every time we arrive, we have this nose full of these incredible senses:, the smell of moss, crushed grapes, barrel, fire and oak. 

Yeah. So we’re like, wow. Every time we arrive, we’re like, wow, this is really cool.

This is so distinct and unique and just elevates your experience of being there. 

We are going to bring more experiences to the brand when we can, like having an artist in residence, creating visually beautiful contributions.

We have an art collection there that inspired us to bring art to the brand. It’s largely from a diverse group of artists from the West Coast who are very colorful and young and also push boundaries. So our idea with the senses is like we’re trying to This is a brand that you enter into our world and you get to experience people and life in a way that’s very unique and bold and

DancingWinesSonoma

Credit: https://instagram.com/DancingSonoma

Joe Winger: What are both of your backgrounds outside of wine?

Lauren: I was raised in Connecticut and went to Dartmouth for undergrad, was a creative non-fiction writer, so always had that storytelling bent. 

After school, I worked at a lot of businesses in marketing.  Uber Eats, Refinery29, right before the pandemic, I worked for AB and Bev that was my first kind of foray into alcohol. 

Then during COVID, I got my MBA at Columbia.  We all got this massive reset of our priorities.  I come from an entrepreneurial family.  This opportunity arose 

Cynthia: We’re a family who really believes in experiences. I have dabbled in many different areas.  I went to Scripps college. I actually was a dance major until I was not. I became an international relations major. I lived in France for a while. Then moved to New York City and worked for JP Morgan trading stock, money market securities. 

I didn’t find that was my passion, so I went to Harvard Business School and I got a master’s in business. Then I worked for American Express where I started a weekend travel program. It was a little startup within the travel segment of American Express. I got my “sea legs” of starting a business.

I quit that business because I had kids, then I started my own mail order company then I decided again, that maybe I needed a little more education.

I went back and got a doctorate at Columbia in organizational leadership.

I have a consulting firm on the side where I consult leaders and organizations about how to handle complex challenges in a complex world. 

So my daughter [Lauren] gets through business school and we decide to marry all these wonderful experiences together and create something really new and unique.

DancingWinesSonoma

Credit: https://instagram.com/DancingSonoma

Joe Winger: Let’s talk about your wines.

Lauren: We launched with our rosé which is really beautiful. It’s an intentional rosé. From our Primitivo grapes and we harvested them early and intentionally for rosé.

It has this really beautiful distinct, watermelon, almost Jolly Rancher aroma, and it’s really playful and full, but also dry. And it’s been a really big hit so that was a fun debut for us. 

We just launched our trio of reds, and what makes them unique goes into the story about the restoration of the vineyard.

We’re still learning our land and learning from it. 

We chose to harvest from different blocks and treat the wines in a similar fashion and bottle them separately to see what personalities they expressed. 

One is the Old Vine Zinfandel, which is from our oldest head trained vines which is the deepest, moodiest, richest wine. It’s really lovely.

DancingWinesSonoma

Credit: https://instagram.com/DancingSonoma

Then we have an estate wine, which is actually from Primitivo, a different word for Zinfandel. That one is a bit lighter. 

Then we have a third, a duo which is a blend of both. And so it’s really helped us to understand. And they are quite different.

They’re obviously all Zinfandels in their expressions, but they’re all quite different. 

People say Zinfandel is like a map of the land and I think that’s really true here. Which is super cool. 

But we have two forthcoming sparkling wines because I think it really speaks to our ethos about being playful and to my generation.

Cynthia: It’s really fun for us because being on the East coast, Zinfandel is a really unknown varietal and we think it’s underrated. Californians know it’s been around for a long time. It has a lot of possibilities with food. And so what we’re trying to do is bring to light this really good wine and do it in a slightly different way.

We pick ours earlier, trying to have it be less jammy, juicy, heavy; lighter, less alcoholic than some of the more traditional Zinfandels that are on our street. 

That’s really trying to address the changes consumer changes.

Our wines are chillable, super easy to eat with most any food, especially ethnic food, spicy food.

2022 was our first vintage. 2023 is already in barrels and we’ll be bottling that in probably in March. But it’s going to be a little different because the climate was different that year.

The rosé was just a fluke. Our winemaker wanted to try a Zinfandel rosé. Most people love it. It’s so distinct and unique.

Our 24 Rosé will come out in March.  The reds will come out in the early summer. We’re going to bottle the sparkling in January, but that will be at least a year until you’ll see that. The  pétillant naturel will probably be launching at about the same time as the rosé

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Lauren: What’s fun about having both an early release sparkling and a [second, additional] later release [sparkling wine] one is going to be lighter, more effervescent, maybe geared towards the younger generation and the other will have that toastier champagne flavor.

Joe Winger: Do you have a favorite wine and food pairing?

Lauren: This one’s so hard. Rosé and oysters or any seafood is just awesome. Sparkling wine and a burger is one of my favorites.

In terms of red, when I think of Zinfandel, it’s Thanksgiving foods.  It speaks to the hominess in our story. Bringing everyone around the table. Kind of experiential pairing.

Cynthia: Yeah, that resonates with me. 

We have a lot of ethnic food, so it holds up really well to spice, to sweet and sour, salty and sweet. So it’s great with Indian food, Mexican food. Apples in your pork chops. 

A burgundy is usually killed instantly by those kinds of flavors. It’s too fragile.

[Ours] is not fragile, but it still has so many nice aromas and flavors to enhance whatever you’re eating.

Lauren:  It’s great with pizza. Pizza and a nice glass of Zinfandel

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Joe Winger: What’s something magical about Sonoma that you learned through this journey?

Lauren: True of both Zinfandel and Sonoma it always has this underdog energy to Napa. One of the hidden gems, we wake up really early and drive to the Redwood forest to watch the sun rise through the trees.

We eat a burrito because we have terrible burritos in New York.

There’s an amazing food community, 3 Michelin star restaurant, chefs, farm to table.

Cynthia: The distinct part of Sonoma is how important nature is to everyone there. It’s not just about wine. It’s incredible nature.

We both traveled a lot, lived in a lot of places. I’ve never seen such natural beauty in such a small area.

Lauren:  That’s what the idea of our products is too.  We have to bring people here in some way, differently than just having them taste the wine.

So as many dimensions as we can bring people into that realm to experience [00:29:00] that it’s like definitely the dream.

Joe Winger: Whether it’s social media, website, or other ways, what are the best ways for our audience to find and follow Dancing Wine?

Lauren: We have our website, which is wearedancing.comWe also are on Instagram, which is at DancingSonoma

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